'23 RG Day 13 OoP & Discussion

[ashkor87]

I would certainly have wished Alcaraz had stopped rather than play severely compromised..Leylah lost 6 months due to her foolish bravado...

[mick1303]

Roger beat Pete at his favorite tournament at age 19...

It would've been much bigger deal if Roger then won the tournament. But he didn't.

These victories become memorable 10-fold if they result in winning the trophy. Likewise, if Djokovic loses the final, his victory over Alcaraz will be a mere footnote. But if he wins, this victory in today's match will hardly have any analogy. Just imagine if Rosewall won one of those finals against Connors.

[nelslus]

COME on now. The kid is 20. This is not a death knell at 20 years of age. Roger beat Pete at Wimbledon- and then lost to Henman. Look- I am disgusted with this result (Novak had looked like c r a p on clay- playing possum or whatever, who knows), and that this "new generation" has never been able to truly figure out Novak/Rafa/Roger, especially at Slams. But, again- this guys is 20 freakin' years old, and has had a terrific career already. Comparing him to Tsitsipas and that this is going to be some kind of huge setback, etc. is just way too over the top. Alcaraz will need to get in better condition, and improve his return AND his serve. He'll have to learn that he isn't Rafa- and shouldn't play a million clay tournaments before Roland Garros. HOW many times must I repeat that Novak lost plenty of big Slam matches early in his career due to a lack of conditioning and needing to improve his game. He's done OK since that period of his life. By now, we all have proven that we really have ZERO idea of what is going to happen with these players. In any case-seriously, y'all need to stop judging and burying the careers of very young players.

[nelslus]

Roger beat Pete at his favorite tournament at age 19...

It would've been much bigger deal if Roger then won the tournament. But he didn't.

Ding, ding, ding, ding!!!! See my most recent post- which I clearly was in the middle of typing out before your post.

[Owendonovan]

I recall Roger saying he moved on from these kinds of loses rather quickly, day or 2. Time for all the players out of RG to get their head in the grass game.

[mick1303]

To continue on that: in 2000 Sampras lost to 20 yo upstart Safin in the US Open final. Safin looked incredible that year - 7 titles. BTW, no Russian player before or since managed to win as many titles in one year. Next year Pete avenged that loss in the semis of the same tournament. It would've been 10-times bigger deal had he managed to beat Hewitt in the finals.

[ponchi101]

COME on now. The kid is 20. This is not a death knell at 20 years of age. Roger beat Pete at Wimbledon- and then lost to Henman. Look- I am disgusted with this result (Novak had looked like c r a p on clay- playing possum or whatever, who knows), and that this "new generation" has never been able to truly figure out Novak/Rafa/Roger, especially at Slams. But, again- this guys is 20 freakin' years old, and has had a terrific career already. Comparing him to Tsitsipas and that this is going to be some kind of huge setback, etc. is just way too over the top. Alcaraz will need to get in better condition, and improve his return AND his serve. He'll have to learn that he isn't Rafa- and shouldn't play a million clay tournaments before Roland Garros. HOW many times must I repeat that Novak lost plenty of big Slam matches early in his career due to a lack of conditioning and needing to improve his game. He's done OK since that period of his life. By now, we all have proven that we really have ZERO idea of what is going to happen with these players. In any case-seriously, y'all need to stop judging and burying the careers of very young players.

It's not judging. The site is called TALK ABOUT TENNIS. What are we supposed to do, not discuss a loss by a very promising young player to the GOAT? We cannot bring statistics and anecdotes into the conversation?
And if somebody wants to bury a player's career after a loss, go for it. Time will tell if such a person is right or wrong. If somebody wants to claim that Carlitos will soon join Andy Roddick as a one slam wonder, let them say so. We will see.
But let's talk about tennis.

[ponchi101]

Zverev/Novak could be a bit competitive. But Ruud's game fits into Novak's game completely.
And it really looks like Ruud is taking this one.

[nelslus]

BTW- when Novak wins the Grand Slam this year, eventually becomes President of Serbia, and pushes That Button- I shall blame all of you Macbeth Witches. I beseech you all. Repent immediately from your vile negativity, you beasts, REPENT!!!!

....ON a more positive note- I am very, very happy with the women's doubles results from today. COME ON TAYLOR AND LEYLAH- WIN YOUR FIRST SLAM TITLE!! (OF course, I have nothing but love for Hseih. If she wins with Wang- all good. But, I do especially want Taylor to win some doubles Slams- my Rajeev Mojo is sent her way.)

[nelslus]

COME on now. The kid is 20. This is not a death knell at 20 years of age. Roger beat Pete at Wimbledon- and then lost to Henman. Look- I am disgusted with this result (Novak had looked like c r a p on clay- playing possum or whatever, who knows), and that this "new generation" has never been able to truly figure out Novak/Rafa/Roger, especially at Slams. But, again- this guys is 20 freakin' years old, and has had a terrific career already. Comparing him to Tsitsipas and that this is going to be some kind of huge setback, etc. is just way too over the top. Alcaraz will need to get in better condition, and improve his return AND his serve. He'll have to learn that he isn't Rafa- and shouldn't play a million clay tournaments before Roland Garros. HOW many times must I repeat that Novak lost plenty of big Slam matches early in his career due to a lack of conditioning and needing to improve his game. He's done OK since that period of his life. By now, we all have proven that we really have ZERO idea of what is going to happen with these players. In any case-seriously, y'all need to stop judging and burying the careers of very young players.

It's not judging. The site is called TALK ABOUT TENNIS. What are we supposed to do, not discuss a loss by a very promising young player to the GOAT? We cannot bring statistics and anecdotes into the conversation?
And if somebody wants to bury a player's career after a loss, go for it. Time will tell if such a person is right or wrong. If somebody wants to claim that Carlitos will soon join Andy Roddick as a one slam wonder, let them say so. We will see.
But let's talk about tennis.

Look- let's Disagree About Tennis then.

IMO, some of y'all are coming off as judgmental and definitive about very young players- and I'm going to continue to call y'all out on this. In addition, I've learned to be very, very careful about proclamations about tennis predictions. And, some of you all (this specific comment is NOT in this case directed at you, ponchi)- are wrong rather frequently.

PS: Barring Novak getting injured or sick- I don't think it would matter who he now plays in the final. VERY slightly, I'd give more of an "advantage" to Ruud, all of a sudden. (No WAY I thought Rudd was gonna make the final- not that it's happened quite yet....) IMO, it feels to me like you've been thinking Zverev would have had a better chance based on a level of play that he used to have, but does not currently have. In any case, it should be a similar score-line of last year's Rafa/Ruud match. UGGGGGHHHHH. (LET me be wrong here, please!!)

[ponchi101]

Totally agree. Our level of being correct in our predictions is somewhere between putrid and "not so bad". Which is the fun part.
And about Novak winning slam finals: heck, I am tempted to update the GOAT table in the GOAT Topic, just to see if there is some jinxing power left in me. Because I just can't see him losing to Casper Ruud. To Zverev, if Zverev were to play at his 100% and Novak were to get injured... he might push him to 5.
Ruud's collection of SLAM RU trophies is very impressive.

[ponchi101]

How do you explain that score?

[Suliso]

One could of course avoid being wrong by not predicting results at all or being "captain obvious", but what's the fun in that?

[nelslus]

One could of course avoid being wrong by not predicting results at all or being "captain obvious", but what's the fun in that?

For me, it's just when folks are so definitive about their opinions. Trust me- I sure as hell have no great history with my tennis picks, either. PS; Captain Obvious often fails these days with tennis.

[nelslus]

Totally agree. Our level of being correct in our predictions is somewhere between putrid and "not so bad". Which is the fun part.
And about Novak winning slam finals: heck, I am tempted to update the GOAT table in the GOAT Topic, just to see if there is some jinxing power left in me. Because I just can't see him losing to Casper Ruud. To Zverev, if Zverev were to play at his 100% and Novak were to get injured... he might push him to 5.
Ruud's collection of SLAM RU trophies is very impressive.

*I'll tell y'all what....if y'all truly want to condemn The Youngsters- consider that these players have assisted with finding a way for Ruud to get to 3 Slam finals- most egregiously at the Us Open....AND, ya know- the same Youngsters allowed Zverev to make this Roland Garros SF....

*I'll tell y'all what....if y'all want to talk about a huge result setback....Zverev. THIS match was far more indicative of his 2023 level. And, two miserable Roland Garros SF results. NOT gonna feel good.

*The, admittedly, the very, VERY!!!! faint hope of a Novak upset....I mean, Novak has had squirrely recent big match results. The Medvedev US Open final. The Olympics- bizarre melt-down matches against Zverev and Carreño Busta (for the bronze medal). I mean, COME on. He's due for an end-stage Vinci Beats Serena result moment- right?!?! (Albeit, LOL, I just looked up and found out that 2019 Creaky Roger beat Ruud at Roland Garros in straight sets. And Ruud has never won a set against Novak. So.....)