College Football Thread

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Re: College Football Thread

#76

Post by ptmcmahon »

For the second time this week, a top ten team has scored 45... and lost :)

What a fun week of games it has been. I fully expect the championship game to be a stinker now.
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Re: College Football Thread

#77

Post by ti-amie »

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Re: College Football Thread

#78

Post by ponchi101 »

And which desperate NFL team would take him? It is not as if he was stellar in his previous stint.
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Re: College Football Thread

#79

Post by ti-amie »

ponchi101 wrote: Mon Jan 02, 2023 11:55 pm And which desperate NFL team would take him? It is not as if he was stellar in his previous stint.
I'm so glad I'm not crazy. When I read that I said to myself he failed the first time so why would this time be any different?
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Re: College Football Thread

#80

Post by ptmcmahon »

ponchi101 wrote: Mon Jan 02, 2023 11:55 pm And which desperate NFL team would take him? It is not as if he was stellar in his previous stint.
44-19-1 with 3 NFC championship appearances in 4 years and a Super Bowl apperanace isn't stellar?

You have some tough standards :)
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Re: College Football Thread

#81

Post by ponchi101 »

ptmcmahon wrote: Tue Jan 03, 2023 2:06 pm
ponchi101 wrote: Mon Jan 02, 2023 11:55 pm And which desperate NFL team would take him? It is not as if he was stellar in his previous stint.
44-19-1 with 3 NFC championship appearances in 4 years and a Super Bowl apperanace isn't stellar?

You have some tough standards :)
No, I was misinformed. I did not know those were his numbers (I did remember his SB with the 49'ers).
It was that I remember that he was basically run off by the Niners. So now I am confused. Why was his departure such a stinker? Those are not Urban Meyer's numbers.
Txs for the correction.
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Re: College Football Thread

#82

Post by ptmcmahon »

Shouldn't be a surprise but he didn't get along with the front office. Harbaugh wanted more control than he had and it turned ugly. Also, I read today he was hoping to be able to be more involved with disciplining his players with legal issues.

He seems the type of coach that can come in for a few years, help a team do well, but not a long term coach to me. I wouldn't be surprised if someone hires him and they do well. I would be surprised if he was still there (and happy at least) in 5-6 years.

College, where he can be the face of a program and run it as he sees fit, seems a much better spot for him.
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Re: College Football Thread

#83

Post by JazzNU »

ptmcmahon wrote: Tue Jan 03, 2023 5:41 pm Shouldn't be a surprise but he didn't get along with the front office. Harbaugh wanted more control than he had and it turned ugly. Also, I read today he was hoping to be able to be more involved with disciplining his players with legal issues.

It was truly a personality clash and Jed York's mismanagement at work there as well. Jim was looking for the kind of control that Kyle Shanahan (and zero executive or coaching experience John Lynch) have right now, which isn't truly asking too much for someone that has already gotten the team to the SuperBowl. Maybe you don't give him everything, but he wasn't out of line asking either. Jed wasn't willing to take a step back until not just that blew up in his face, but also the pitifully ill-informed Chip Kelly hire did, not to mention appointing and sticking with freaking Trent Baalke as GM as long as he did. It took Jed a long while to realize he wasn't his grandfather, but once he did, he took a step back and that let the team flourish in a more productive and cohesive manner. You barely hear about him anymore, when you heard about him constantly before, he was way too Jerry Jones with his management, and it got in the way big time.


@ponchi, Jed York was heavily criticized for Harbaugh's firing.
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Re: College Football Thread

#84

Post by JazzNU »

This came up the other day with Kliff Kingsbury's being fired so I thought I'd post it since we were talking about Jim Harbaugh recently. You'll notice Harbaugh is a glaring outlier among the list of college coaches jumping to the pros. There is truly zero reason he was fired other than Jed York didn't want him there anymore and he was willing to go back to his alma mater and fix Michigan to bring it back to prominence. But other NFL teams were interested, and his name will keep coming up this time of year for vacancies. He was just a successful head coach, this isn't Nick Saban where they wonder if he'll try again and see if he can succeed this time around. He also has good relationships with several owners and that will keep his name around as well. Billionaire owners not used to hearing no thinking they can be the one to convince him to come back.



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Re: College Football Thread

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Post by ptmcmahon »

List is missing a pretty successful one (Pete Caroll) 128-78-1 with 10 playoff wins a Super Bowl.
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Re: College Football Thread

#86

Post by JazzNU »

ptmcmahon wrote: Thu Jan 12, 2023 10:11 pm List is missing a pretty successful one (Pete Caroll) 128-78-1 with 10 playoff wins a Super Bowl.
No it's not, he doesn't count. NFL head coach to College HC back to NFL HC for Pete.
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Re: College Football Thread

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Post by ptmcmahon »

Well that makes the list pretty specifically tailored to what Schefter wants. Does that mean being an assistant coach in NFL (as Harbaugh was) before being a head coach in college is ok? :) Or coaching USFL like Spurrier did doesn't count?

Either way I still know there is interest and expect him to have a good run. I just don't see it being long. He'll be in another Jed Yorke situation within a few years I'd guess.
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Re: College Football Thread

#88

Post by JazzNU »

ptmcmahon wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 3:06 am Well that makes the list pretty specifically tailored to what Schefter wants. Does that mean being an assistant coach in NFL (as Harbaugh was) before being a head coach in college is ok? :) Or coaching USFL like Spurrier did doesn't count?

Either way I still know there is interest and expect him to have a good run. I just don't see it being long. He'll be in another Jed Yorke situation within a few years I'd guess.
No it doesn't. It's a list that many have stated in the past. Ignoring that Pete Carroll had 2 stints as an NFL Head Coach before he was a College Head Coach would be an unfair comparison in a list like this. He wasn't even a bad NFL head coach. There's a reason those USC teams were clicking on all cylinders once he was able to revamp things there and that 2008 team was one of the best college teams ever.

Harbaugh was never an assistant head coach or coordinator in the NFL prior to his time as a college head coach, he was a position coach in the NFL, which is quite a bit different. But yeah, most don't track that and plenty of coaches have split experience. Jumping from head coach in college to the NFL is a different metric with a much lower success rate. This is a very clear list that many have used in the past, it's hardly a Schefter thing.

2000 is the main delineation here. Take away that year and then you have Jimmy Johnson, Barry Switzer, and Tom Coughlin in the list and there are probably others as well that would make it hard to fit this into a single Tweet.
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Re: College Football Thread

#89

Post by ptmcmahon »

Harbaugh was a QB coach for Raiders before being a head coach in college.

Either way I'm not disagreeing with the point... but saying he clearly cherry picked the requirements of his list to make a point, such as cutting it off at 2000 like you say :)
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Re: College Football Thread

#90

Post by JazzNU »

ptmcmahon wrote: Fri Jan 13, 2023 8:54 pm Harbaugh was a QB coach for Raiders before being a head coach in college.

Either way I'm not disagreeing with the point... but saying he clearly cherry picked the requirements of his list to make a point, such as cutting it off at 2000 like you say :)
What I'm saying is, you have to have a cutoff for a Tweet. The year 2000 is a natural place to cut it off, there is almost no time when Pete Carroll makes that list. No one ever puts Pete on this list and if you every find someone doing it, they add in asterisk, because it's just different experience.

Not sure if you don't like Schefter or what, but many other covering the NFL put out the exact same list. It's not cherry picking, it's character count. You can't add in the ones I mentioned without going over. This has been a talking point for ages, these are the facts at this point.. The jump from college to the NFL is not a cake walk and partly due to dealing with men not children and also due to how the teams are made up and Saban, for instance, not being able to assemble a team full of 4 and 5-star recruits like he does at Alabama and did at LSU. Kliff Kingsbury is an outlier of sorts though, with questionable college success and still becoming a NFL head coach. His struggles were much more foreseeable than the others and he arguably did better than most thought he would.

Yes, Harbaugh was a QB coach, which is a position coach. There's similar experience in plenty of others, but it's not a head coaching position, which is the comparison point that is almost always used. Watch ESPN, Fox Sports, sports radio, whatever, they use head coaching positions as a comparison point for something like this. Coordinator positions would be next after that and is pretty rare to hear about anywhere but when speaking about a specific coaches' experience, i.e., I've never seen a graphic of college coordinators success as NFL head coaches.
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