I watched a documentary about Althea Gibson the other night on PBS.
Then I found this gem...
Althea was quite an accomplished golfer after her tennis career was over, as well...
.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Sun Feb 20, 2022 7:33 pm
by ti-amie
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Sun Feb 20, 2022 7:34 pm
by ti-amie
I'm hoping, along with the last poster, that new European indoor events will be held next year.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Sun Feb 20, 2022 10:49 pm
by JazzNU
I've never understood this particular part of the criticism about the WTA. To me, they seem to be trying their best for the most part, but they have an uphill battle that can't be won as quickly as those, particularly in the West, want and expect to happen. So much criticism seems to be about how they aren't run well because they don't have as many tournaments week in and week out as the ATP, and no mention of just straight up sexism. Unless and until @ponchi can easily watch a random early round match of a WTA tournament on TV in Colombia of a non-South American player, then I can't be surprised that the women have less tournaments. Clearly they have less buyers of their product in various markets simply because they are marketing women.
Also, even when they get tournaments, it's no guarantee it's a long-term commitment because several times, the interest in having one is tied to an emerging or existing star in their own country, think of the tournament that used to be in Denmark. Then it was gone. With Clara emerging, maybe there will be interest again. But this is something the ATP just doesn't seem to have to deal with much.
I'm as hopeful as others that we'll get there, but the expectations people place on the WTA to become an exact mirror of the ATP in tournaments and pay immediately while rarely mentioning the problems they contend with that the ATP doesn't has never made a bit of sense to me. Even here in the US, there are numerous comments on Tennis Channel's posts while airing a WTA match complaining about airing the "substandard women's matches" when it's like Kvitova vs. Sabalenka and to "just put on the ATP."
It has never been an apples to apples situation. I wish more of the tennis reporters on Twitter added more context to their WTA criticism and comparisons such as this, because they consistently throw shade at the WTA.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 9:33 am
by mick1303
JazzNU wrote: ↑Sun Feb 20, 2022 10:49 pm
I've never understood this particular part of the criticism about the WTA. To me, they seem to be trying their best for the most part, but they have an uphill battle that can't be won as quickly as those, particularly in the West, want and expect to happen. So much criticism seems to be about how they aren't run well because they don't have as many tournaments week in and week out as the ATP, and no mention of just straight up sexism. Unless and until @ponchi can easily watch a random early round match of a WTA tournament on TV in Colombia of a non-South American player, then I can't be surprised that the women have less tournaments. Clearly they have less buyers of their product in various markets simply because they are marketing women.
Also, even when they get tournaments, it's no guarantee it's a long-term commitment because several times, the interest in having one is tied to an emerging or existing star in their own country, think of the tournament that used to be in Denmark. Then it was gone. With Clara emerging, maybe there will be interest again. But this is something the ATP just doesn't seem to have to deal with much.
I'm as hopeful as others that we'll get there, but the expectations people place on the WTA to become an exact mirror of the ATP in tournaments and pay immediately while rarely mentioning the problems they contend with that the ATP doesn't has never made a bit of sense to me. Even here in the US, there are numerous comments on Tennis Channel's posts while airing a WTA match complaining about airing the "substandard women's matches" when it's like Kvitova vs. Sabalenka and to "just put on the ATP."
It has never been an apples to apples situation. I wish more of the tennis reporters on Twitter added more context to their WTA criticism and comparisons such as this, because they consistently throw shade at the WTA.
It is true, those circumstances are beyond WTA control. But making an adequate website is completely within their control. Nonetheless they neglect to do so. ATP site is well structured and have easily accesible archive and players database. There are some issues but generally it is 10 times better than that of WTA.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 11:25 am
by Fastbackss
"When you focus on how the process isn't working fast enough for your liking it impedes the long term progress"
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 4:46 pm
by ponchi101
Of course, right now I cannot watch Colombian TV because I am not in Bogota, but to add to JazzNu's assessment: last year, ESPN had a big promotion on "follow Nadia Podoroska and all the stars of the WTA... on ESPN PLAY and ESPN +". Those are their website platforms. I don't think I saw one single Podoroska match on the regular cable ones the entire year (I know, she did not go too far on any tournament).
And I know wonder if, with Maria Camila's rise, any Colombian TV station is showing Guadalajara. So, if you can't get on TV, you don't get any money. It is that simple.
I know that they will show Bogota, but that is because they only have to point a camera out of the station's window (I jest). But that is not the way to increase participation in the sport, both for young people playing and all people watching.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 6:47 pm
by JazzNU
mick1303 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 21, 2022 9:33 am
It is true, those circumstances are beyond WTA control. But making an adequate website is completely within their control. Nonetheless they neglect to do so. ATP site is well structured and have easily accesible archive and players database. There are some issues but generally it is 10 times better than that of WTA.
I specifically said "this particular part" of the criticism against the WTA. Where did I once mention the website? I've been one of the biggest critics of the WTA site on this forum.
This feels like purposely glossing over the larger points I mentioned since I very clearly limited what I was focusing on. Sexism impeding the sport and a website not being well managed. One should get more ire than the other.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 7:08 pm
by ti-amie
All you have to do is listen to JMac when he is forced to call a WTA match (not that he knows anything about ATP players not based in the US but he doesn't even pretend to care about the WTA). The thing is the WTA has done next to nothing to make the men who run tennis have to deal with them as equals. Allaster's deal with China was disastrous but she did seem to fight for the women to get equal media coverage and grudging respect for the WTA. Steve Simon has succeeded in making the WTA disappear.
The thing is these days a website is many new fans first impression of your sport and if you know next to nothing about the WTA but have seen some exciting matches that made your curious you would be sorely disappointed visiting that horrible web site. Sexism is real but when you're shooting yourself in the foot day after day you can't blame it just on idiots like JMac.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 7:19 pm
by ti-amie
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2022 1:29 pm
by ti-amie
So there was this in Acapulco last night...
Followed by this
What is the difference between being "withdrawn" and being "defaulted"?
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2022 1:31 pm
by meganfernandez
ti-amie wrote: ↑Wed Feb 23, 2022 1:29 pm
So there was this in Acapulco last night...
Followed by this
What is the difference between being "withdrawn" and being "defaulted"?
Oh my god. He could have easily hurt the umpire's foot or leg. This should be more than a default eventually. That was awful. Also, I'm guessing withdrawn and defaulted are synonymous for all practical purposes, but I'm not sure.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2022 1:41 pm
by ti-amie
There's an argument about it on TennisTwitter and it seems most of us don't know the difference either. There should also be a huge fine.
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2022 2:12 pm
by Deuce
Not really a smart thing to do after you've been accused of assault...
Re: Tennis Random, Random
Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2022 2:15 pm
by meganfernandez
ti-amie wrote: ↑Wed Feb 23, 2022 1:41 pm
There's an argument about it on TennisTwitter and it seems most of us don't know the difference either. There should also be a huge fine.
I prefer "thrown out on his hiney."
Huge fine and a couple months of suspension at least, I'd think. Wonder what the rules say. Has TennisTwitter dug into the rulebook yet on suspensions for unsportsmanlike conduct?