Talk About Tennis 2.0

Fans have been doing dumb stuff and brawling long before "reality shows and UFC." But will agree with the rest, especially alcohol. Sports fans can be pretty dumb. And I imagine it used to happen just as often, just no one had cell phones to instantly record and upload it.

I never experienced anything much like that, although I did go to a Green Bay @ Cincinnati game in my Favre jersey. It wound up being the game Favre threw a career high 5 picks (surprising he only did it once.) On the way back to the car I was jeered by many drunken Bengals fans. I imagine it may have been worse if Green Bay had won, or maybe if I hadn't been with my Bengals jersey wearing wife. Halfway to car I just took jersey off...wasn't worth the slight risk of anything at that point.

ti-amie wrote: ↑Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:30 pm I have no idea what started this brawl.

Mayeb it's just me, but wondering if this rises to the level of brawl. Seemed rather tame and a corny version of a fight. They got lucky no one involved knew how to fight I think, most places someone would've laid you out 30 seconds into this and been done with this nonsense if this was the level they were bringing.

ptmcmahon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:21 am Fans have been doing dumb stuff and brawling long before "reality shows and UFC." But will agree with the rest, especially alcohol. Sports fans can be pretty dumb. And I imagine it used to happen just as often, just no one had cell phones to instantly record and upload it.

I'd hazard a guess it actually happens a bit less now. In addition to knowing you can get recorded and caught more easily now and the least drunk in your crew maybe steering you away from these things, there's been less incidents it would seem at the stadiums. The on-site judges/courts have mostly disappeared I think because it's just less of that. At some sporting events they'd allowed more

Smartphones weren't around in the 80s and 90s, but regular TV cameras were. The more destructive stuff was caught by the local news all the time and we saw it, less stuff that happened in the stadium than nonsense occurring outside, but still, nothing to do with the advent of the smartphone.

I still say that the growing presence - and inherent influence - of cesspools like 'reality shows', UFC, WWE, etc. is largely responsible for this stuff. In those cesspools, the dominant theme is complete disrespect - disrespect is viewed as a virtue, and is encouraged, while respect is portrayed as a weakness... And I don't believe for a second that it's at all co-incidental that we've seen a significant decline in the basic respect people give each other in society over the course of the past 30 years or so.

You realize WWE has been on TV for at least 35 years now right? Not sure id call that a growing presence at this point Seems strange to put that in time wise with reality TV and UFC.

When I was a kid there were a lot more fights and my school than I see at my kids schools now. I don’t think any of this is new. People have been disrespectful to each other for more than 30 years. We just get to see it easier now.

Aristotle was already complaining about young people in his time having lost all respect for elders. It's an age old complaint of old people.

JazzNU wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 2:11 am

ptmcmahon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:21 am Fans have been doing dumb stuff and brawling long before "reality shows and UFC." But will agree with the rest, especially alcohol. Sports fans can be pretty dumb. And I imagine it used to happen just as often, just no one had cell phones to instantly record and upload it.

I'd hazard a guess it actually happens a bit less now. In addition to knowing you can get recorded and caught more easily now and the least drunk in your crew maybe steering you away from these things, there's been less incidents it would seem at the stadiums. The on-site judges/courts have mostly disappeared I think because it's just less of that. At some sporting events they'd allowed more

Smartphones weren't around in the 80s and 90s, but regular TV cameras were. The more destructive stuff was caught by the local news all the time and we saw it, less stuff that happened in the stadium than nonsense occurring outside, but still, nothing to do with the advent of the smartphone.

I would also posit rising prices of alcohol (even accounting for inflation) at major sporting venues is another factor as to why I'd warrant fewer fights occur now.

Suliso wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 10:51 am Aristotle was already complaining about young people in his time having lost all respect for elders. It's an age old complaint of old people.

Show some respect, young man!!!!!

JazzNU wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 1:57 am

ti-amie wrote: ↑Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:30 pm I have no idea what started this brawl.

Mayeb it's just me, but wondering if this rises to the level of brawl. Seemed rather tame and a corny version of a fight. They got lucky no one involved knew how to fight I think, most places someone would've laid you out 30 seconds into this and been done with this nonsense if this was the level they were bringing.

Ha Ha so true re the level of "fighting". I laughed at the young men who were like "I want nothing to do with this" and made sure to stay out of range. Still, this is insane.

ptmcmahon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 10:39 am You realize WWE has been on TV for at least 35 years now right? Not sure id call that a growing presence at this point Seems strange to put that in time wise with reality TV and UFC.

When I was a kid there were a lot more fights and my school than I see at my kids schools now. I don’t think any of this is new. People have been disrespectful to each other for more than 30 years. We just get to see it easier now.

Actual fist fighting, of the "hold my coat" variety, is a lost art. Like Jazz said anyone who really knew how to fight would've put an end to this pretty quickly. WWE is tame by comparison to what it was 20 or more years ago. I agree about UFC though. Barbarism.

I think the level of disrespect between people has grown though. You see it in all the rage incidents taking place in stores and on airplanes.

ti-amie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 5:30 pm ...

Actual fist fighting, of the "hold my coat" variety, is a lost art. Like Jazz said anyone who really knew how to fight would've put an end to this pretty quickly. WWE is tame by comparison to what it was 20 or more years ago. I agree about UFC though. Barbarism.
...

Suliso wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 10:51 am Aristotle was already complaining about young people in his time having lost all respect for elders. It's an age old complaint of old people.

Rather than 'old people', I'd say 'people who have observed and experienced life in different facets and elements'.
And, yes, respect for fellow humans has diminished rather noticeably over time. Not co-incidentally, materialism, greed and selfishness have steadily increased over time, as well.

I still say that in the past 30 year or so, the disrespect has accelerated. This can be seen in television (and now, streaming, too) - as TV is a reflection of society, just as society is a reflection of TV. It's a mutual influence.

Since becoming regulated I don’t know if I’d call UFC barbarism. It really is mixed martial arts now often and certainly much less barbaric than say plain ol boxing.

ptmcmahon wrote: ↑Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:38 am Since becoming regulated I don’t know if I’d call UFC barbarism. It really is mixed martial arts now often and certainly much less barbaric than say plain ol boxing.

I completely disagree. Not that boxing is healthy - and there has certainly been corruption in boxing - but you don't hit the guy when he's down in boxing, for one. In UFC, it's just hitting after hitting after hitting. It IS barbaric.

UFC is also run by a complete asshole. Dana White is the same kind of character as Vince McMahon - both will do anything for a buck. Don King was bad - but these two guys are significantly worse. Both are no-class assholes. White has called various UFC fighters (essentially his employees) all kinds of vulgar names - he can't complete a sentence without it including vulgarity... and it's all done for ratings and money. Because, sadly, this garbage appeals to many people and helps to sell his barbaric product.

You also see several characters from both the WWE and UFC dying early - either via suicide or some other violent means. Some have murdered others (outside the ring). Several others have been in trouble with the law.
Not exactly organizations which exude class.

Have you watched any UFC? Yes some matches are largely "hitting" but many matches are not - lots of wrestling, jujitsu etc. I won't argue whether or not it's barbariac, but I will say it's less than boxing. For a numeric consideration look the number of deaths in each sport. MMA has 7 ever and 0 of those were in UFC. Boxing has more than that just since the last MMA death in 2016. If you consider MMA barbariac, boxing has to be at least as bad.

No argument about Dana White being an asshole.

WWE has tons of people dying early. Haven't seen it as much with UFC yet, although there are a few. I don't pay attention to boxing though, but I'm sure some ex-boxers have died as well. NFL may be the worst of many sports there with all the CTE related deaths.

Not sure why boxing is getting a free pass from you, unless because it's not as "new" as MMA?