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Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:01 pm
by meganfernandez
ponchi101 wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:51 pm And now that we mention it. We spoke little of this, or I can't recall if at all. What do we think?
I think that if that errant ball had not gone the wrong way, Novak would have won the final. Sure, Carreño Busta was playing well and so were the other guys, but I can't see them beating Novak on a hard court at a slam. Not yet.
(Recent Aussie Open final myopia at work, admittedly).
Who knows. That's why the matches are played. :) Novak would have been the favorite but Thiem wasn't far behind him on hard court. Novak seemed maybe testy... questions about Adria, stressful circumstances in NYC with the pandemic, the whole PTPA thing. To me, the asterisk on Thiem's title is there but faint. He might have been robbed of the chance to win the title "legitimately." Not his fault. The Big 3 haven't always beaten each other for Slam titles and we don't penalize them.

I'd love to know how many Slams the Big 3 have won without having to face either of the other 2. Maybe that's a tad bit of extra weight in the GOAT debate. Which I DEARLY hope is tied at 20 or 21 when all is said and done.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:07 pm
by ponchi101
Oh, to be clear. I put no asterisk next to Thiem's title. It would have been the same as if Novak had been injured, or PCB had actually beaten him, or 100 different circumstances. The only Slam I will ever put an asterisk next to it is Kodes '73 Wimbledon, and that only to explain it. He still won it, playing his 7 rounds and beating his opponents.
Thiem won fair and square. But, in an alternate universe, maybe the lines person sneezed right at that moment and the ball went by her. And Novak is at 19 Slams and were are still waiting for somebody to break through.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:07 pm
by JazzNU
ponchi101 wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:51 pm (Recent Aussie Open final myopia at work, admittedly).
It must be. Make your mind remember the 2020 Aussie Open final a bit more clearly and the antics Novak had to pull to get that win. I have no trouble seeing Thiem beat him at the US Open.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:10 pm
by meganfernandez
ponchi101 wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:07 pm Oh, to be clear. I put no asterisk next to Thiem's title. It would have been the same as if Novak had been injured, or PCB had actually beaten him, or 100 different circumstances. The only Slam I will ever put an asterisk next to it is Kodes '73 Wimbledon, and that only to explain it. He still won it, playing his 7 rounds and beating his opponents.
Thiem won fair and square. But, in an alternate universe, maybe the lines person sneezed right at that moment and the ball went by her. And Novak is at 19 Slams and were are still waiting for somebody to break through.
totally possible. Maybe likely. Djokovic is so metaphysical and philosophical and borderline nuts, I wonder if he thinks there's a reason it happened that way, since it was utterly bizarre and wildly against the odds.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:24 pm
by ponchi101
JazzNU wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:07 pm ...

It must be. Make your mind remember the 2020 Aussie Open final a bit more clearly and the antics Novak had to pull to get that win. I have no trouble seeing Thiem beat him at the US Open.
That is an interesting take because I remember that final very well. I was in Argentina, coming from a job and I was beat. So, I woke up, watched the first three sets and when Thiem won the third, I told myself "He is not winning. Back to sleep" (my eyes were closing).
Later in the day they showed the replay and we know what happened. So, although I can also see Thiem beating anybody on court, I can also see Novak beating anybody on a hard court. Sure, we will never know but, were I a gambling man with the miraculous time machine, and were I forced to put money down on the hypothetical Thiem/Novak final, my shekels would be on Novak.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 7:16 pm
by JazzNU
I'm asking this seriously. Do you just remember him winning or do you also remember the antics?

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 7:56 pm
by ponchi101
I remember both. I am not doubting your statement about his behavior, which was pretty shady.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:18 pm
by Deuce
ti-amie wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 6:18 pm
It's a stupid question - because the only honest, legitimate answer is "Maybe".
The only reason to ask such a question is to create gossip (and it has worked).
No-one - including Thiem - knows the answer to the question.
Seriously - what can possibly be gained by asking such a question? Absolutely nothing.
If he answers 'yes', people will say he's unrealistic and conceited; if he answers 'no', people will talk about an asterisk. It's a 'no win' situation.
AND - even Thiem himself cannot possibly know the answer to such a stupid, hypothetical question. It's like asking "Do you think you still would have won if you strung your racquets 5 pounds lighter?"

When the only honest, legitimate answer to a question is "Maybe", that is the same as giving no answer - because it's not possible to give an answer - and that negates the question.

I think the reporter has a right to ask the question... but I think it's an incredibly dumb question.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:22 pm
by ti-amie
It's a "gotcha" question - damned if you do and damned if you don't. The problem with tennis journalism is that outside of Briggs, Clarey and a few others there are a lot of folks who get credentialed who are just angling for that clickbait quote. Tennis is the only sport where transcripts don't indicate who the reporter is asking the question. It's been a problem for years.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:34 pm
by meganfernandez
What happened to our Tennis Journalism thread? Do we have one? I wish we did.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:32 pm
by ponchi101
meganfernandez wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:34 pm What happened to our Tennis Journalism thread? Do we have one? I wish we did.
Still here:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87#p772

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:01 pm
by JazzNU
meganfernandez wrote: Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:34 pm What happened to our Tennis Journalism thread? Do we have one? I wish we did.
Ponchi posted the link, but also, don't forget, if there's a thread you'd like that doesn't exist, you're welcome to start it.

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 7:11 pm
by ti-amie


Dzumhur : “I couldn’t take the injustice anymore”
Damir Dzumhur claims that he was not disqualified against Botic van de Zandschulp in Acapulco, and that he made the decision to leave the court because he was treated unjustly. He also denies allegations that he threatened to kill the umpire.

Image

15 mar 2021 by Sasa Ozmo
It has been a long day at the office for the former world No 23 Damir Džumhur. Trailing 6-5 in the first set against Botic van de Zandschulp in the second round of qualifying in Acapulco, Sunday, the Bosnian didn’t finish the match.

In his own words, he chose to leave the court because of perceived bad calls by the chair umpire, though it will officially be recorded as a default because he threw in the towel after losing his temper and receiving a warning and point penalty. The ATP explains to Tennis Majors :

“Dzumhur received two code violations for unsportsmanlike Conduct (warning, point penalty) and his failure to complete the match resulted in an immediate default. This is in the section “Failure to compete a match” in the ATP Rule Book.”

In that manner, Džumhur continued a poor run of form since 2021 started; he lost in the first round of Australian Open as a lucky loser, and then went on to lose in the first round of qualifying in Montpellier.

“It is important for me to emphasize that I was not disqualified, I have chosen to leave the court voluntarily”, said Džumhur, now ranked 125th in the world, to a panel of local journalists in his native language, although the ATP website states that Van de Zandschulp won by default.

The video footage here confirms apparently what Dzumhur is saying.



Džumhur continues his account :

“Simply, I could not bear that someone treats me very badly, that he can do whatever he wants; the umpire directly influenced the match with his bad calls. The last straw was the ball at 5-5 and 40-40; it was clear that the ball was out, but he did not react and I have lost that game.”

While admitting that he was angry, 28-year old from Sarajevo denies that he threatened to kill the umpire, Joshua Brace from the USA :

“I honestly do not know where some websites have found the information about me threatening that I would kill anyone. It is true that I have said to the supervisor that I felt the need to hit the umpire because of what he has done to me. Supervisor suggested that it was not such a great idea, that I could further damage myself. I have answered that I do not care since I was nervous, but I did manage to regroup myself and leave the court. I have not threatened that I would kill anyone, I do not know where that came from, especially since there is video footage of the whole thing.”

Džumhur regrets not being able to hold his temper
Džumhur lost the game at 5-5 and, at 5-6 before his opponent served for the set, he continued his argument with the umpire during the changeover.

“I have told him at the changeover that I can and that I will sue him because he directly influenced my loss. He gave me a warning for saying that. I do not know how anyone has the right to give me a warning for those words. I got up, but I was already very upset… I won the first point of the next game and then I have made another comment, I cannot remember exactly what at this point; but the umpire told me ‘it is enough’. I answered that it was not enough and that I will decide when it is enough. Then he gave me the second warning, meaning a point penalty. In my head I felt that the huge injustice is being done to me, I could not control myself anymore since I was extremely nervous about the whole situation. I reiterate – I have left the court, I was not disqualified.”

Džumhur has been prone to emotional outbursts on the court in the past. He regrets not being able to hold his temper, but feels that he was wronged.

“I am really sorry that I was not able to control my emotions, because I let someone to affect me so much and for him to make me so upset. Because of my family, I am sorry that I have not shown that I am stronger than everything that has happened, but I was treated unfairly and the damage to me was done, I stick to that.”

This story recalls the famous incident at Wimbledon in 1995 when American Jeff Tarango “defaulted himself” by leaving the court before what became a post-match disqualification and subsequent suspension. It also echoes Nick Kyrgios’ continuing abuses against the umpire during Cincinnati loss against Karen Khachanov in 2019.

https://www.tennismajors.com/news/atp-t ... 27501.html

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 7:37 pm
by ti-amie

Re: Tennis Random, Random

Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 7:46 pm
by the Moz
For shame Zoom, wise move Shapo :thumbsup: