Legal Random, Random

[ponchi101]

They look so non-violence prone...
Not.

[ti-amie]

[ti-amie]

[ti-amie]

[ti-amie]

Elmer Rhodes is on trial accused of seditious conspiracy. He's been on a "charm offensive" of sorts when his attorneys were questioning him. Now an AUSA surnamed Rakoczy (RAK in tweets) is cross examining him and it's kind of interesting.
QRF = Quick Response Force
RH = Rhodes (Elmer is his real first name)
OK(s) = Oath Keepers


Jury has been excused for morning break.
Now Rakoczy discussing emails that she disclosed this weekend that had Woodward (for Meggs) was bent out of shape over this morning. They concern effort Rhodes made to get his open letters to Trump through a donor

/69
to the OKs who had a son doing something with the White House. FBI interviewed the the donor and she said she never tried to do anything with the letter.
Another email is about info about Rhodes considering going to Portland or Vancouver in Sept 2020 with goal of baiting

/70
Antifa to attack to start a conflict. She says the defendants previously knew about that information.
Linder (for Rhodes) says he doesn't think the new information is relevant. Mehta is suggesting that Linder has opened some doors.

/71
The emails come from the Montana FBI Agent Mark Saylor who was mentioned during the direct. The information seems to come from confidential human sources (CHSs).
Judge Mehta is saying that Rhodes did not incriminate any other defendants, so he's not sure they ...

/72
should be permitted to cross-examine Rhodes. But it sounds like he'll permit a bit of questioning (rather than having Rhodes to resume stand later as part of that particular defendant's case).

(...)

AUSA Rakoczy will do cross:
discussing founding of OKs.
you claimed ... in response to policies of bush administration? didn't found till april 2009?
right.
after Obama inaugurated?
right.
launched 4/19/09. you said that was to commemorate a moment in adams administration/
/87
right.
But that's not reason is it?
don't understand.
you chose because that's where shot heard round the world occurred that started american revolutoin?
no. ...
and you chose 4/19?
date heard round the world?
right.

/88
went on Alex Jones that day & admitted it was about commemorating shot heard round the world?
well, in part.
and on website you mentioned shot heard round the world & not thing involving adams administration?
possibly.

/89
Rakoczy showing website ad for the launch.
She's moving it into evidence.
painting across the top depicts battle at Lexington in april 1775.
Now showing video of him on Alex Jones show promoting launch of OKs. [hard to hear audio but he's talking about
/90
shot heard round the world. nothing about the event he mentioned on direct during the Adams administration.]
Rak: from outset OKs took tone of forcible opposition to govt?
no.
Rh: in 2014 sent OKs to nevada to assist cliven bundy to resist court order....
Rak: we sent them to
Rhodes: sent them to protect his family from being Waco'd. ...
Rak: gave them AR-15s. warned that if govt was going to enforce them ... you'd be there to resist.
Rhodes: we were there to protect family from being burned to death.
Rak: no fires at Waco ...

/92
that's what we feared.
Rakoczy now showing video of Rhodes at time ... [hard to hear audio again ... seems to be threatening to resist govt by force]
Rak: they also deployed OKs to mining towns in 2015-16. sent them with rifles?
yes.
Rak: like to have OKs who are

/93
former police.
yes. puts my people on front lines.
now talking about 2017 event in Berkeley.
you wanted them to bait the people didn't you?
no we focus on deterrence.

(...)

/97
Rak: tell me about insurance OK org has to do security?
Oh, organization? no. but some of us do.
Rak: law enforcement not finding your org helpful?
Rh: not true. local group in ferguson loved us.
Rak: deployed to Louisville in 2020. One national, one by local chapter

/98
Rak: went there to protect property?
and life.
Rak: that's the cover you need, right?
that's incorrect.
She's showing messages taken from his phone from CO OK chat. August 2020: "when it comes to cracking heads, if you articulate that you'll leave yourself exposed ...

/99
Rhodes: there has to be a legitimate reason.
Rak: there has to be a *stated* legitimate reason?
Rh: that's not what it say.
Reading from his message that talking about "cracking heads," that's what got the Proud Boys in trouble ...

/100
he wrote at time: "anyone who publicly announces that they are just going to confront antifa/blm are setting themselves up and can be easily prosecuted after the fact. ... you just killed your own self-defense line."
Now showing another exhibit about Louisville

(...)

/111
Video showing OKs in that parking lot in Louisville.
Shows Rhodes, NC lead Doug Smith, Michael Greene, Jessica Watkins, Montana Siniff.
Rhodes: we're getting our gear on to get ready to go protect gas station.
Rakoczy eliciting that crowd is saying '(expletive) you, (expletive) you"...
/112
and many OKs have their guns out.
Now seeing Kelly Meggs. Guy in middle is Holden Haney (OK IL) with skeleton/american flag mask/gaiter. Haney has a rifle. Meggs has 2 AR magazines in his vest pouch.
Rak: doing more to inflame situation than help?
Rh: No.

Now showing a tape of the 11/9/20 GoToMeeting:
Rhodes: ... when i was walking thru Portland i ... had my helmet. ... that was to whack someone right across the face if they're going to come at me.

(...)

/116
Rh: i was talking about how they could use C-cell flashlights and other things that were legal to carry.
Rak: batons too?
Rh: i chose not to bring mine. ... it's a gray area, & i love em, and I chose not to.
Rak: and you advised them to dress up like old people to bait

/117
Antifa?
not true.
Now showing receipt from store called Smoky Mountain Knife Works. Purchase he made on 11/19/20 on OK credit card.
3 cold steel heavy duty canes or walking sticks
5 cold steel pistol grips.

/118
Now showing what those pistol grips look like.
Rak: And you told Zimmerman that you wanted OKs to dress up as vulernable and try to bait Antifa into attacking?
Rh: He misunderstood.
Rak: also told Josh James that?
Rh: no.

/119
Now discussing NC OK Randy Earp. his group went to Louisville. Rhodes exchanged messages with Earp.
9/26/20 message after a Louisville op.
Earp: did Doug do well with you? ...
Rhodes: very satisfied. ...
Earp: ... [anything you want to tell Doug?]
Rh:

/120
Rh: Doug did very well on QRF with me last night. ... at end of night had an incident at end of night ... [some sort of confrontation ... ]
... approached drunk black guy ... Doug pointed rifle at him. approached him in his truck as if a traffic stop. ... it was diffused.
/121
Rak: 3 days after election he met with NC leaders, including Doug. Rhodes bought rifle, then came to DC.
now 11/7/20: Rhodes to Friends of Stone Signal chat:
... what's the plan ... i'm on the way to DC now ... to do leader's recon and make plans.
Rh: Stone, ali alexander
/122
Rak: Tarrio?
Rh: don't know if he was on that chat at that time.
Going to take our lunch break now till 1:30pm.
Judge speaking about the recently disclosed information relating to alleged attempts to bait Antifa is Vancouver or Portland. Rakoczy says gist of it

/123
was previously disclosed to defense counsel in another form. Mehta seems satisfied.
Everyone breaking till 1:30pm

/124 The theme of Rakoczy's cross so far seems to be that Rhodes uses various noble, high-minded sounded narratives as "legal cover" to justify fundamentally lawless thuggery. She's argued that in 2014 he was helping Cliven Bundy resist a court order with force; ...

/127
that while he claims to want to protect people from Antifa, he told OKs in Nov 2020 (per OK John Zimmerman, who testified earlier) to dress like the elderly or women in order to "bait" an Antifa attack so he could given them a "beat-down"; and it sounds like

/128
she wants to elicit another instance of alleged "baiting" of Antifa relating to actions he took in Vancouver or Portland; and she's also shown that while he says the OKs help police, several police forces have asked him to leave saying they inflame matters &

/128
make them worse. The obvious ultimate example she's building to is the govt's claim that all his talk about the Insurrection Act itself was just another "legal cover," because he planned to try to stop Biden from taking power by force regardless of what Trump did.

P1/3

[ti-amie]

P2/3

Jury seated.
AUSA Kathryn Rakoczy resumes cross.
fall of 2020, OKs contemplated operation in Vancouver/Washington area.
Rh: memorial service for person shot by Antifa?
Rak: member of patriot movement killed in Portland.
Rh: assassinated on street.
Rak: many people upset.
/132
Rh: discussion about whether to have memorial service at location of his assassination. ... decided not to.
Rak: discussed going on Alex Jones show to let everyone know you were going to go? Plan to announce you'd be in Vancouver Washington? Plan was so you could

/133
have your weapons and bait antifa and have them come across the line and ambush them?
that is not correct.
Rak: you say you're not in it for money. but you draw salary. last 12 years or so you use OK money to pay for your dinners & travel?
yes.
Rak: & firearms?
yes.

/134
Rak: use OK credit card for personal expenses quite a bit?
Rh: wouldn't say that. full time job.
Rak: one board member resigned over your use of OK funds?
Rh: fair to say.
Rak: fair to say you did not file income taxes from 2008-2020?
Sidebar.

/135
She moves on period after presidential election.
Rak: you urged your followers to resist the result?
Rh: correct
Rak: you opposed biden as president?
Rh: yes.
Rak: you referred to biden/kamala as chicom puppets? so it's not just process, it's result?
Rh: it's both.

/136
Rh: my opposition came from the constitutional problems.
Rak: not the fact that they were ChiCom puppets?
Rh ...
Rak: you said SoRelle thought she saw election fraud?
Rh: yes.
Rak: what she actually saw was news crew bringing in equipment?
Rh: that's what news media said.
/137
now showing 11/7/20 Rhodes to Old Leadershp Chat:
"answer must be to refuse to accept ... these imposters ... get your gear squared away and ready to fight."
another 11/7/20: to friends of stone chat
"the final defense is us and our rifles."

/138 "trump has one last chance right now to act ... but he will need us and our rifles too. but will he act? only if we act and call on him to lead us."

In that message Rhodes links to a video from a Serbian friend about overthrowing Serbian govt.

/139
Not showing Rhodes

/140



talks about swarming streets ... culminating here, with storming of parliament. ...


Rh: i only meant this in the future context, not with respect to before inauguration.
Rak: you say: "it has to happen NOW."
Rh: that's not what i meant.

Now playing an audio tape of Rhodes' GoToMeeting of 11/9/20: ... let's make no illusion ... in same spot that

/143
foundingn fatehers were in in March 1775. ... nothing left to do but fight. ...
Rh: right, but on condition trump invokes insurrection act.
Rak: later you said they need to be prepared to fight regardless of what trump did?
Rh: later, yes. ...

/144
Now talking about QRF for 11/14/20 event.
Rh: purpose was to defend against a benghazi style attack on white house.
Rak: you thought secret service couldn't manage?
Rh: He had had to go the basement earlier.

now talking about 12/12/20 Jericho event. there...

/145
you implored trump to invoke insurrection act?
Rh: yes to do mass declassification and data jump.
Rak: president doesn't need insurrection act to declassify docs, does he?
Rh: no, but needed to use it to use national guard and unorganized data to help seize the data.

/146 Rak: was this the data that was going to expose CIA & NSA officials as pedophiles?
Rh: that and other things.
Rak: isn't what you really wanted him to do is call you all up as private bodyguards?
Rh: no. ... down the road we'd have no choice but to fight. if you leave office
/147
without fixing this.

12/14/20 electoral college meets, makes biden winner?
Rh: yes, unconstitutionally, yes.
Rak: you wrote, Trump has one more opportunity to act, must invoke insurrection act.
Rh: 12/14 wasn't big priority in my mind.
Rak: that's why you post this ...

/148
talking about bloody civil war & revolution?
Rh: ...
Rak: you're talking about a call to arms to help keep Trump in power.
Rh: wouldn't want to characterize it like that.
Now showing open letter 12/14

/149
Cover photo is Washington leading troops into battle.
Rak: you wanted trump to use troops to keep him in power?
Rh: wanted him to declassify data.

now reading: imploring Trump to invoke insurrection act to "stop the steal and stop the coup"
now second open letter of 12/23
/150
calls on Trump: "immediately order ... national guard to order new election ... do not conceded ..."
Rh: i'm referring to state officials certifying unc'l results.
Rak: throw out election and hold new one?
Rh: well supreme court hadn't heard case challenging c'lity.

/151
Rak: so it got all the way to SCOTUS and declined to take the case?
Rh: yes, illegitimately.
Rak: and you said SCOTUS should be declared illegitimate?
Rh: no, well, can't remember, what did i say?

/152
In the 12/23 open letter he tells Trump to declare that ruling because 7 of the 9 justices refused to hear the case illegitimately. ...

Rak: A lawsuit had been filed? highest court didn't take case. so legal challenges had been exhausted?
Rh: yes, but supreme court did not
/153
do it's duty.
Rak: says you.
Rh: says a lot of people. ...
i think trump had a responsibility to defend constitution when others failing to do so.
Rak: what's to prevent every president in future from invoking Insurrection Act throwing out result & delcaring new election?

/154
that's the problem when you're in an uncharted election.
Rak: insurrection action has never been used to throw out an election has it?
Rh: we've never had an election like this one.
Rak: you knew J6 was hard constitutional line?
Rh: yes. i supported challenges but didn't

/155
hold much faith in them.
Rakoczy showing Rhodes message of 12/15/20 to Friends of Stone:
president must do it now before J6 ... tragic mistake to wait for J6 or after. Congress will stab him in the back.
Believe can't trust Mcconnell?
yes.

/156
you can't because his wife in Chinese?
Rh: in part, yes. ... i think she has ties to communist party in china.
Rak: and her husband Sen. McConnell too?
Rh: yes.

Rak: you knew either Trump would have to invoke insurrection act or you & your followers would have to act?

/157 not correct.

showing message from Rhodes 12/10/20: either trump will invoke Insurreection Act ... or we will have to rise up to oppose the chicom puppet.
Rak: so civil war would be on J21 and not J6?
Rh: not necessarily.

/158
Now showing message from Rhodes to SoRelle on 12/29: ... "i'll turn my attention to what comes after Trump fails to do his duty. ... i think an open letter to the current serving US military is needed ... [about J6] they won't fear us till we come with rifles in hand."

/159
Now showing Rhodes a video of his interview with FBI Agent Palian.
Rh: i did not know this was video'd.
Rak: it's a body-worn camera.
Sidebar.
playing video.
[hard to hear audio]
"by january we knew there would be zero percent chance he'd invoke insurrection act."

/160
she's now reading more of his messages: "be ready to roll any way we are needed, get your gear squared away."
now 12/21 to OKFL Hangout: "need to push trump to do his duty. if he doesn't, we will do ours ... conquer or die. this needs to be our attitude."
Rh: that would be

/161
post J6.

& more of his messages:
12/31/20 rhodes: on the 6th they'll put final nail in coffin of this republic unless we fight our way out. with trump, preferably, or without him. we have no choice.

/162
Rak: so you came to VA prepared to fight?
Rh: no. well, we had a qrf.
Rak: you personally brought 100s of rounds. You paid $17,000 for gun-related materials?
Rh: yes.
Rak: organized a QRF?
Rh: didn't have a vehicle. ... I knew Meggs had gotten 2 hotel rooms

/163
did not know there was anyone sitting on them.
Rak: this was planned within plane sight of you.
Rh: I didn't know about Stamey & Caldwell's side chats.
Showing him J2 message from Meggs to Rhodes: "last night we discussed QRF RP."
Rhodes respondes: OK. we WILL have a QRF. ..
/164
the situation calls for it."

now showing him another message from Meggs to him saying "we have the overlay of maps and Lincoln is the RP if SHTF." Rhodes responds, "cool. ... I'll reimburse you."

Now showing him message from Meggs to DC OP Jan 6 21 ...
/165
On J2 Meggs is talking about the QRF on that.
... Meggs says: 1 if by land (north side of Lincoln memorial) 2 if by sea (c'o of west basin) ... QRF Rally Points. water if the bridges get closed.
Rh: i saw them but i didn't really know why he was posting these. wasn't my op.
/166
Rak: buck stops with you in the operation?
Rh: i'm not in charge when they do something off mission.
Rak: you're OK chairman of board for life?
right.
Rak: Command structure carried over into operations?
Rh: no, that's not right.

/167
Now showing Rhodes message of 12/30 to DC Op Jan 6 21:
"prefer that cohesive teams under under the immediate leadership of their [team] leader but ... of course under my overall command."

Rak: "overall command" would be yours.
Rh: only step in if i see a major problem.

/168 Rhodes brings up "commander's intent."
Rak: so you were familiar with concept of commander's intent?
Rh: yes. selected greene & siekerman. we were there to protect latinos for trump, escort ali alexander, general escort duties ... etc.

/169
Now showing message Rhodes sent 12/25 to OKFL Hangout:
trump needs to know we support him in using insurrection act. ... if congress rubber stamps an unconstitutional fraud, president trump must ddefend the constitution and we use him to use the insurrection act ...

/170
we will support him ... and he needs to know if he fails to act then we will. he needs to understand that we will have no choice."
Rh: yes, but that's post J6.
Rak: but you don't say that do you?
Rh: a few slides earlier. ... [but it's not there either, Rakoczy shows.]

/171
Rak: on J6, you told followers VP had "punked out"?
Rh: ummmm, i don't remember. [Rhodes has begun to say "ummmm" frequently to start his answers.]

Now talking about QRFs again.

/172
Rak: when you were interviewed by FBI agent Palian on 5/3/2 you told him you had no knowledge of the QRFs?
Rh: that's the problem with that term, it means so many different things to different people.
Rak: perhaps it would help to play the video. ...

/173
[again, I can't make out the audio.]
Rak: You tried to say you weren't privy to the plans of the NC guys.
Rh: yes.
Rak: but you added the NC guys to the DC Op Jan 6 21 chat right?
...
Rh: i knew about vallejo.
Rak: but you didn't tell Palian about him either right?

[I don't know what's coming through from reading the cold disjointed record of my tweets, and of course I'm just one person. But to me this is very very powerful cross by Rakoczy. The word "demolish" comes to mind. ...

/176
... When you're down to arguing that your civil war wasn't supposed to start until January 21, as opposed to starting Jan. 6, I think you're on the defensive. Also, he basically said that he distrusted Sen. McConnell because his wife is Chinese. That sort of blows ...

/177
a hole in the claim--which he went out of his way to raise--that he has no racism. He tried to recover by saying she had ties to the Chinese Communist Party, but as a cabinet official under multiple administrations it's a stretch. Rakoczy also effectively had him admit

/178
that no president in history had ever used the Insurrection Act to nullify an election & keep himself in power and that, if a president could do so, any president could use it to nullify all the laws & constitutional provisions governing transition of presidential power.

/179
Judge Mehta's back.
Rhodes back on stand.
Awaiting jury. (Here, by the way, is a sample message Rakoczy showed him. His response to these is, basically, to say the revolution wasn't supposed to begin J6; not until after J20.)

/180


Jury back.
AUSA Rakoczy continues cross.
Turning to J6.
At 1:45pm Greene called him at said they're storming the Capitol.
Rh: i said who? he said Trump supporters. then went to meet him.
Rak: saw there was no event going to take place ... & walked into restricted area.

[ti-amie]

P3/3

Rakoczy is now showing a compilation exhibit that tracks the progress of the various OK groups converging on the Capitol on a map, with a timeline.
At 2:31 he received call from Greene. (Rhodes concedes these time stamps are correct.) Talked to him for 45 seconds, before he
/187
gets a call from Kelly Meggs. Rhodes picks up and merges call with Greene.
Rak: can't hear a word he says, but you merge him with Michael greene anyway?
Rh: [yes.]
Rak: now 2:32:18 to 2:33:48 sec. ...
Rak: for 90 seconds you're just saying, 'hello, hello, i can't hear you?'
Rh: yeah, but i could still hear greene.
Finally Meggs hangs up at 2:33pm. and two minutes later, about 2:35pm, Meggs leads stack 1 up the steps?
Rh: yes, but i found that out much later.

/189
Rak: and they breach the capitol at 2:39?
Rh: no, they walk in after others breach it. ...

now showing his message to the ops chat telling people to be very careful what they say & be mindful that people might be reading them.

now showing his message from 7:30pm J6

/190
praising what happened. ... "long day but day when patriots began to stand. stand now or kneel forever."

then went to Olive Garden. SoRelle, James, Vallejo were there. Landon Bentley. Joe Harrington. Todd Kandaris.

/191
Rak: James told you he went inside and you said good job?
Rh: No. ... he lied to me. ... didn't told him till they were in AL later ... showed me a video and didn't play any sound. ...
Rak: he yanked officers and told them to get out of his (expletive) capitol.
Rh: saw that

/192
for 1st time sitting here during this trial.

At Olive Garden sorelle got word FBI was starting to make arrests?
Rh: no ... state police going door to door looking for people who'd been in capitol.
Rak: you abruptly left?
Rh: no, maybe 5 in the morning.
Rak: you left at 1am
/193 Rh: well, maybe --
we heard VA state police going door to door looking for Trump supporters. ...
Rak: trump supporters who'd entered capitol.
Rh: not what we were told
Rak: rounding up trump supporters for no reason?
Rh: that's all we were told.

/194
Rak: you and SoRelle drove to gas station & met up with James? middle of the night?
Rh: whatever time it was.
Rak: greene there. ... guys from KY. you divide up all the firearms and ammunition?
Rh: ummmmmm, i don't think so. ... kellye wanted to go meet someone for ...

/195
some sort of election challenge. she asked me for my phone.
Rak: election challenge at 1am in the morning?
Rh: well, next day or something.
at 1:14am Rhodes was using Landon Bentley's phone?
Rh: uhhhhh, could be.
Landon sends message about "nice places to live in WV"

/196
Rak: you're doing that to secretly discuss rendez-vous spots?
Rh: uhhhhhhh, possibly. yeah [something about] secret squirrels.

at 12:30pm SoRelle says "emergency. need to go to TX. need assistance."
Rhodes: you still planning to go to Huntington WV. Call now. ...
/197
Rhodes: i have a car here. come here now. be a good girl and do as i say. or give me place to see you in TN.
SoRelle: i'll be in bristol in 2.5 hrs.
Rhodes: go there ... text whip ... tell him to go to austin.

Rak: you wanted him to protect you in TX?

/198
Rh. No, i don't need protection. i'm my own bodyguard.

Rakoczy elicits that he gets a burner phone and arranges to meet SoRelle in Bristol, TN.

Rh: i imagine we meet up, but it's been a long time.
Now on J8 at about 11:16am, SoRelle sends message: ALLCON FROM STEWART

/199
THIS IS STEWART ... DO NOT chatter ... anything you say can and will be used against you ... CLAM UP. DO NOT SAY A DAMN THING. ... still in the twilight before open conflict ... do not chat about OKs doing anything at capitol. do not discuss ... shut the f*ck up!

/200
don't write AARs. ... clam up. you all need to delete any of your comments regarding who did what.
Rh: that was not me. that was ms. sorelle. ... she got her phone back and started writing as if it was me.

Rak: you have some level of control over her?
Rh: we were dating

/201 Rak: those messages encourage people to delete incriminating evidence from their phones?
Rh: yes. well, can i /202
see it again?

Rakoczy showing him again. Message accurately says that administrator at that time didn't have power to delete; the individuals had to do it themselves.
Rak: But SoRelle wasn't the administrator, you were.

Rakoczy establishing that Rhodes was disabarred

/203
by state of Montana in 2015.
sidebar
@Brandi_Buchman tells me Rhodes testified of SoRelle: "she's type A outside the bedroom, but inside the bedroom she switches to a sub." (Meaning "submissive," per Brandi.) This is relevant because Rakoczy is saying she wouldn't go ...

/204
... and tell people to delete phones if Rhodes hadn't told her to tell them that. She followed his instructions. He's saying that was true only in the bedroom.
Long sidebar (beginning with reference to his being disbarred in 2015) is still going on.

/205
Rakoczy: state of montana barred you in 2015 for failing to participate in the disciplinary process regarding 2 grievances filed against him.
Rh: i didn't know those existed. they sent them to a PO box. PO box signed for it. i didn't know.
Rak: after Bristol, TN he drove

/206
to AL.
Rak: and you asked Meggs to come to TX to help you even tho he'd gone inside.
Rh: he told me he'd helped people inside.
Rak: and you asked James to come & bring all available firearms?
Rh: no, just what he'd need.
Rak: you stockpiled firarms.
Rh: yes

/207
Rak: did one of store clerks get concerned because you had so much stuff?
Rh: ummmmmm, don't recall that.
Rak: J6 for you was just battle in ongoing war, right?
Rh: no. ... i said we were on eve of conflict. ... not immediate. ...

/208
Rak: you OKs were willing to take steps to alter or abolish this govt?
Rh: yes. i still hoped conflict could be avoided. but we have a govt that steps outside the Constitution it puts you in a bad place.
Rak: & you appointed yourself to take care of that?
Rh: no, ...

/209
[constitution says that? or declaration of independence? not sure what he said.]
Now playing Stewert Rhodes statement to Albers on J10: "my only regret [about J6] is they should have brought rifles ...

/210
if he's gonna just let himself be removed illegally, then we should have brought rifles. We could have fixed it right then ... and hanged pelosi by a streetlamp.
Rakoczy's done.

Linder is doing redirect:
Now he's discussing the bundy ranch. ...
Rhodes says he was there to /211
defend his family only.

Linder's now eliciting violence that allegedly occurred at Berkeley before OKs arrived to restore order.
Linder's eliciting that from 2009 to J6, OKs never cited for violence or force in 100s of events. Rhodes says he forgot about incident with

/212
Doug Smith and the drunk man in Louisville. Only instance of impropriety he knows of.

Rhodes explaining you always have to have a righteous mission. a lawful mission. OKs did that consistently for 13 years.
In Louisville, protected a gas station, two pawn shops...

/213
Rh: we were successful. ... we all remained calm. ...

Rhodes wants to clarify something about the receipt Rakoczy showed him for 2 steel canes and 3 steel pistol grips. He's saying it was only 1 of each. He wasn't going to overthrow govt with 2 sticks, Linder elicits.

/214
These were purchased for us to have in environments that didn't allow guns. Usually Rhodes carries heavy flashlights. Wanted something between lethal force and empty hands.

Linder now showing photo of mayor of Houston, who is black, with his arm around Rhodes ...

/215
after Hurricane Harvey, presumably grateful for their work there.

Now post-election up to J6, Linder acknowledges there were lots of signal messages about invoking Insurrection Act. also some that talk about fighting our way out, Linder acknowledges ...

/216
have you had to fight your way out?
Rh: not yet.
L: it's just bombastic language?
Rh: yes.
L: if college football coach says we should kill the other team, does he mean it literally?
Rh: no.

/217
Rh: my state of mind is that everything i was advocating Trump do would have been lawful.
Linder talking about call between Meggs & Greene & Rhodes--having Rhodes reiterate he couldn't hear, couldn't get through to meggs.
Reiterates that Meggs didn't receive some

/218
texts Rhodes sent for hours.
Mehta asks for sidebar. (Almost certainly about when's a good time to break for the day.)
Linder now eliciting that there was no plan to go into Capitol, and Rhodes didn't order anyone to go in.
Linder's done. Rhodes is done.

/219
Jury is excused for the day.
Bright (for Rhodes) is telling Judge Mehta that they've got 5 more witnesses. 4 are available tomorrow. He thinks they'll finish Rhodes' case by Wednesday afternoon. Meggs says he wants to call 13 witnesses (!)
Today's done. See you tomorrow!
/220

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The full day's hearing is here:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1589 ... 1667859858

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